[ List Earliest Comments Only For Pages | Games | Rated Pages | Rated Games | Subjects of Discussion ]
Comments/Ratings for a Single Item
I have an idea. How about a Ganesha that moves as any piece you just moved?
Appreciate your comment John, and am touched by how much you pay attention! However, I had decided to scrap the old Ganeshan Chess variant in favour of this one instead.
Haha, I'm glad you think so, and please feel free to use any ideas from that game in your own! Over all though I prefer pieces with 'absolute' movement as opposed to movement determined by other variables... and so I concluded that it was too much of a mouth full and that this latest idea, 'Sovereign Chess' is just what my brain needs.
If anybody has a moment, it would be good to hear other's views on the value of this Elephant piece. Please feel free to comment on how many points you think this piece is worth. Thank you.
It is to my understanding that any piece positioned as per Ganesha in this game, and that has a value of Rook or higher, will actually be detrimental to the game, as being easily pinned so early on can completely ruin the game's flow. Therefore I have edited the Elephants way of movement to be more respective of this fact.
This new Elephant really seems like a kludge. How about an Elephant that moves and captures as any piece you have captured? It has a low value in the opening, but becomes very powerful in the endgame, so it is a good piece that does not hamper flow.
I'm open to ideas, but how would it move to begin with... otherwise wouldn't it be just sat there doing nothing? And then again, I don't want a piece more powerful than a Queen.
How about it moves as a Camel, and it assumes the move of its last captive, losing its previous move? It has a unique initial move, so in that lies some power, but it is lost in the endgame if it does not capture before then. Or perhaps it always has an additional Camel move.
I think I'll leave it be.
John, where are you from? Maybe we could meet up and discuss it. Would be nice to meet some real chess variant enthusiasts.
John, where are you from? Maybe we could meet up and discuss it. Would be nice to meet some real chess variant enthusiasts.
The US. I don't think it would be worth your time!
In case anyone was wondering, this Elephant piece's movement has been decided and the game article is now complete.
If anyone has the equipment:
i)10 x 10 board
ii)Two elephants or miscellaneous pieces which could be used as Elephants
iii) Two additional pawns per side
And would like to play me via correspondence, it would be greatly appreciated.
i)10 x 10 board
ii)Two elephants or miscellaneous pieces which could be used as Elephants
iii) Two additional pawns per side
And would like to play me via correspondence, it would be greatly appreciated.
H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jan 7, 2009 04:17 PM UTC:I have no idea what 'any squares a Knight usually passes through' means. Being a leaper, a Knight does not pass through any square, but teleports directly to its final destination. If you have a path in mind through which a Knight reaches its desitination, you should specify the path, as this is not standard. Does a Knight move in an L shape, and if so, does the long leg or short leg of the L come first? Or does it move like the Mao or Moa? Or is it a multipath Moo? Or does it move 3 forward and then back diagonally? Also the phrase 'can only jump if it moves like a Knight' is ambiguous. Does it mean the piece is a hopper?
It means the common way it is interpreted, such as 2 squares along and then one to the side (or vice versa), like as you say an L shape. If however you took the quicker route of say 1 diagonal and then 1 along it could then move 1 square diagonally also. I have included some diagrams to make this more clear.
H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jan 7, 2009 04:56 PM UTC:So if I understand it correctly, this Ganesha moves as K + N + lame Dababba. That makes me severly doubt the value you put on it (4). The K+N piece alone (on 8x8) is super-strong, about 8 (when Q=9.5). Perhaps it loses a little strength on 10x10, but this should be more than compensated by adding the lame-D moves.
Well it kind of has the value of 5, but it's value is severely weakened in the endgame and on a 10 x 10 board. A Bishop in fact could prove to be more useful than an Elephant in the Endgame, so it's kind of worth 4.5, but I wouldn't go so far as to say 5.
It doesn't have the Dababba movement... it can only jump when it moves exactly like a Knight does.
Maybe 5 would be a more accurate value, but I wouldn't say anything more as the Rook and Bishop could out number it in the Endgame.
It doesn't have the Dababba movement... it can only jump when it moves exactly like a Knight does.
Maybe 5 would be a more accurate value, but I wouldn't say anything more as the Rook and Bishop could out number it in the Endgame.
H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jan 7, 2009 05:40 PM UTC:lame D = D that cannot jump. K+G vs K+R is a generally-won end-game on 8x8. I am pretty sure it is the same on 10x10, and that it does not matter much if Pawns are present. (Provided, of course, they are not very close to promotion). The reason is that Ganesha can checkmate (forcing it, so not just help mates like Archbishop) without the aid of its King on any size board (or in fact on a quarter-infinite board). It might take some time before it gets close enough to the opponent King to give the first check, but once it does, you are toast... And a Rook can not give perpetuals like a Queen can: when it tries you approach until you attack it diagonally, and then it has to move without checking, and the Ganesha gets one step closer to the opponent King. (Well, two steps, more likely! ;-) )
Hmmm, I see where you are coming from now. It could be worth more then but I'm still reluctant to give it more than 5.
It is effectively Knight and Pawn, plus King like movement so...
N+P = 4
4 points + a little extra movement (K?) will equal 4.75 - 5.0.
So 5 points plus and minus some variables which effectively cancel each other out... I'd go with 5.
It is effectively Knight and Pawn, plus King like movement so...
N+P = 4
4 points + a little extra movement (K?) will equal 4.75 - 5.0.
So 5 points plus and minus some variables which effectively cancel each other out... I'd go with 5.
H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jan 7, 2009 06:22 PM UTC:How about this then: K+G vs K+R+N on 8x8 is 95% won with white (= the side with G) to move. With black to move still 35% of all positions is won. (There are many positions where black can capture your G or K on the first move, after which you cannot win anymore. K+R+N on the average cover 6.6+5.25+14 ~ 25 squares or 35% of the board, and either your K or G might be in their line of fire, explaining the bulk of the other 65% positions.) I cannot exclude there are some fortress draws. Do you think 5 is a good value for a piece that almost always slaughters a Rook + Knight in the end-game?
I disagree, I've studied several Sovereign Chess openings and any direct attack on the Elephant can be defended.
I challenge you to post an opening sequence where the case is otherwise.
I challenge you to post an opening sequence where the case is otherwise.
H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jan 7, 2009 06:44 PM UTC:Opening? I am talking about K+G vs K+R+N here. With onlyy 5 pieces on the board, I hardly would call that an opening...
Firstly that is a positional variable... each position effects each piece differently - It might be worth more in certain positions, but you can't base its absolute value on merely one position. Secondly I think you are over analysing things.
H. G. Muller wrote on Wed, Jan 7, 2009 07:58 PM UTC:I think you still don't get it. I am not talking about a single position, but about 228 million different ones. Namely all possible positions with this material. Point is that if you hav King + Rook + Knight, and I have King + Ganesha, I will almost certainly beat you, unless it happened to be your move and my Ganesha happened to be hanging,or it is my move and you happened to have a fork or skewer on my King + Ganesha. In other words, if the Ganesha is trivially lost tactically, so that this is not really a K+G vs K+R+N ending at all. But in a tactically quiet position, the Ganesha almost always wins. That is not bad for a single piece, to defeat Rook + Knight with overwhelming superiority. A Queen cannot do that, for example.
25 comments displayed
Permalink to the exact comments currently displayed.