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Mats W wrote on Fri, Feb 3, 2006 07:48 AM EST:
I have implemented Louridas's 'Bario' for Zillions. It's a sophisticated cyclic chess variant. It doesn't play well, but it's good for studying this interesting chess variant.

Bario

Mats

Adrian Alvarez de la Campa wrote on Fri, Feb 3, 2006 06:59 PM EST:
Interesting...I independently invented a similar game, which evolved into Undecided Chess (the ZRF is here). In my game the pieces start out as berolina pawns, which then can change into other pieces by moving like them. and there is only one 'cycle'. If anyone would like to play it with me over Zillions or by mail, let me know.

Alfred Pfeiffer wrote on Tue, Mar 21, 2006 10:18 AM EST:
I could contact the inventor Panos Louridas and resolve some of the details
that remained untold in the article and my previous comment (19.01.2006).

First I should mention again, that an essential paramater in this game is
the _number of types_ of pieces that a player owns. If it is only 1 or 
less then for this player virtual play never occurs. This ruling principle
will help (I hope) to understand the following clarifications.

1) We should complete the rules about the capturing of pieces (real
or virtual) by the following:

If the number of types of pieces (real and potential) of a player will 
reduced by the capture to 1 and he owns virtual stones yet then the 
virtual piece(s) of this player will be replaced instantly by the 
potential pieces they stand for, and this event is not the start of 
a recycling (because such players are excluded from playing with 
virtual pieces).

2) Promotions of Pawns:

The owner of the pawn chooses (at usual) a piece to become for the pawn.
This pieces goes to the resevoir and becomes a virtual piece on the board

then and only then if the number of types of pieces in the reservoir 
will be greater than 1 (including the new piece by the promoting).
If this condition is not fulfilled the promoted piece stays a real piece.

Examples:

a) Before the promoting of a pawn the player does not own any other 
   piece.  Then the promoted piece will remain real evidently.

b) Before the promoting of a pawn the player owns only one type of other
   piece(s) (always real by the rules mentioned above). If he chooses
   for the promoting pawn the same type as he already owns then all
   of his pieces will stay real; if he chooses for the pawn a piece of
   another type then instantly all of his pieces will go to the his 
   reservoir and will be substituted by virtual piecs on the board.
   Furthermore the player also will take part again in the future
   recycling cycles.

c) Before the promoting of a pawn the player owns more than one types
   of pieces, but all of them except one are already in the real state.
   If now the player chooses the same type of piece like the one that
   is represented by his last virtual piece then the promoted piece
   stay real; if he chooses a type other than that of the virtual
   his promoted piece will become virtual and the choosen type of
   piece will be added to his reservoir.

d) Before the promoting of a pawn the player owns more than one types
   of pieces and at least two of its pieces are in the virtual state 
   and stand for different types.  In this case the promoted pieces
   always becomes a virtual piece and the choosen promotion goes to
   the reservoir.


Friendly Greetings,
Alfred Pfeiffer

Ivan Roth wrote on Mon, Mar 7, 2011 08:55 PM EST:Excellent ★★★★★
Now, I have never beaten Zillions at any game before, or even brought it to a draw, on any difficulty setting. In Bario, I bring it to a draw any time, always have the clear advantage in the endgame, and check frequently. This is all on the 'Expert' setting. I think the AI's main problem is that it doesn't understand the value of a queen, which cannot be substituted in capture. It allows its queen to be captured, leaving me with an advantage, since I am more careful. In general, it seems to have difficulty judging the relative value of the pieces. Is this a function of the implementation, or is the game itself too abstract for Zillions? I have yet to play this game against a human, so I may be missing something. Food for thought.

M Winther wrote on Tue, Mar 8, 2011 01:15 AM EST:
If it's my implementation you have used, it is very lousy and should be reworked. The code is too heavy and slows the program down. Nor does it follow the initial rules exactly. But I never got around to it because I think the variant is inferior. It is not a serious variant, but merely entertaining. Maybe you could try Barion instead, a related variant, which Zillions plays better.
http://hem.passagen.se/melki9/barion.htm
/Mats

Ivan Roth wrote on Fri, Mar 11, 2011 03:05 AM EST:
I don't see what you mean about it not being a serious variant, I find that it has quite complex strategy, perhaps more so than normal chess. As for Barion, I don't see that it is really very different, aside from the added complexity of the quantums getting a one-time teleportation before they stabilize.

M Winther wrote on Fri, Mar 11, 2011 11:58 AM EST:
An awkward aspect of Bario is that a rook and a bishop becomes much stronger than a queen, due to the movement choice he has when the pieces are in potential state. It wrecks the relation between the pieces. If you play well and gain material, it might turn out that the opponent is stronger anyway. But it could be fun. That's why I said that it was for entertainment, not serious chess.

In Barion Zillions plays much better, that's the point. Probably it lacks those unfair characteristics of Bario. Whether it's a good variant I don't remember. It's from 2006.
/Mats

Ivan Roth wrote on Fri, Mar 11, 2011 10:57 PM EST:
Hmm.  I think that Bario does screw with piece dynamics, although a queen is still very valuable in the endgame.  Having now had a chance to play this physically, I agree that it is very fun, and that it stretches the mind in ways that normal chess doesn't (In particular, making sure not to trigger a recycle while your opponent has a realized piece that, once virtual, could immediately capture your king).  I'm not sure about barionic, I might try it out if there's a zrf.

By the way, this info page should be updated in light of the comment below which claims to have located the relevant article.

Paolo wrote on Tue, Mar 1, 2016 08:39 AM EST:
This looks really an exciting idea. Did you consider to add Fairy pieces to the mix?

Eric wrote on Wed, May 1, 2019 10:51 AM EDT:

Panos Louridas, the inventor of this chess variant has a website with explanations and description of Bario:

https://www.bario-chess-checkers-chessphotography-spaceart.de 


Florin Lupusoru wrote on Thu, Feb 22, 2024 01:13 AM EST:Excellent ★★★★★

It's a shame that great ideas are buried and forgotten. This game has a great potential and I'm really impressed by such a simple idea. 

Also, this game deserves a better name. 


Bob Greenwade wrote on Thu, Feb 22, 2024 10:59 AM EST in reply to Florin Lupusoru from 01:13 AM:

I agree with Florin, about both this game's potential and its name.

Perhaps it could be called Schrödinger's Chess?


🕸Fergus Duniho wrote on Thu, Feb 22, 2024 11:10 AM EST:

Compare to David Howe's Potential Chess.


HaruN Y wrote on Thu, Feb 22, 2024 07:08 PM EST in reply to Bob Greenwade from 10:59 AM:

There was already Schrödinger's Chess. https://github.com/dittmar/schrodingers_chess


Bob Greenwade wrote on Thu, Feb 22, 2024 07:22 PM EST in reply to HaruN Y from 07:08 PM:

Well, that kinda spoils that idea. :/


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